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Flights canceled in Phoenix due to heat


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#1 CHamilton

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Posted 20 June 2017 - 09:55 AM

It’s so hot in Phoenix, planes are physically unable to fly

https://www.theverge...-cancel-science

 

Extreme heat affects a plane’s ability to take off, especially smaller jets like those that service American Airlines’ regional routes. Larger aircraft manufactured by Boeing and Airbus have maximum operating temperatures of 127 degrees. But smaller planes, like the Bombardier CRJ regional aircraft, can only operate at a maximum temperature of 118 degrees.

 

 


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#2 fairviewroad

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Posted 20 June 2017 - 11:14 AM

1. Build a giant, air-conditioned dome over the airport.

 

2. Strategically place flaps in the dome that the air traffic controllers can quickly open and close.

 

3. Pilots aim for these flaps upon take-off and landing.

 

4. I've solved your problem, Phoenix. You're welcome.



#3 Devil's Advocate

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Posted 20 June 2017 - 12:25 PM

In recent years planes have been sinking into melting tarmac as well.  Good thing we outlawed science and physics.


I used to be with ‘it,’ but then they changed what ‘it’ was. Now what I’m with isn’t ‘it,’ and what’s ‘it’ seems weird and scary.


#4 ehbowen

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Posted 20 June 2017 - 01:36 PM

1. Build a giant, air-conditioned dome over the airport.
 
2. Strategically place flaps in the dome that the air traffic controllers can quickly open and close.
 
3. Pilots aim for these flaps upon take-off and landing.
 
4. I've solved your problem, Phoenix. You're welcome.


Here in Houston we might consider such a solution workable....

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#5 railiner

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Posted 20 June 2017 - 02:42 PM

Trump would say..."fake news".... :P


metroblue?

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#6 Bob Dylan

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Posted 20 June 2017 - 02:50 PM

When the ATC is privatized they can charge Airlines extra for Take Off/Landing Clearance!🤔😄
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#7 railiner

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Posted 20 June 2017 - 07:40 PM

 

1. Build a giant, air-conditioned dome over the airport.
 
2. Strategically place flaps in the dome that the air traffic controllers can quickly open and close.
 
3. Pilots aim for these flaps upon take-off and landing.
 
4. I've solved your problem, Phoenix. You're welcome.


Here in Houston we might consider such a solution workable....

 

Or......they could borrow a trick from a long time ago....attach a pair of RATO.s to the aircraft...


Edited by railiner, 21 June 2017 - 02:18 PM.

metroblue?

okay on the blue!

#8 Hotblack Desiato

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Posted 21 June 2017 - 08:37 AM

It's incorrect to say the planes are physically unable to fly.

 

It's just that the certified performance charts of those types of planes only go up to a certain maximum temperature.  Those charts are what get used for load planning, runway calculations, etc.  Once above that temperature, there is no guide for what is legal & safe.



#9 Metra Electric Rider

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Posted 21 June 2017 - 09:24 AM

In recent years planes have been sinking into melting tarmac as well.  Good thing we outlawed science and physics.

 

 

Maybe they should try that ancient Roman invention - concrete?


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#10 Devil's Advocate

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Posted 21 June 2017 - 10:01 AM

In recent years planes have been sinking into melting tarmac as well.  Good thing we outlawed science and physics.

 
Maybe they should try that ancient Roman invention - concrete?


Replacing the asphalt aprons and taxiways of major airports with cement is expensive and time consuming. There are some newer more temperature resistant formulations of asphalt but as temperatures keep going up they'll eventually need to be replaced as well. Over time cement use is becoming more common but considering it took decades to build what they have now it will likely take decades more to dig it up, haul it away, and replace it again. These are major multi-year projects that take substantial time and resources to complete. Not to mention funding it all. It's not just taxes and PFC's that will increase but landing fees, parking fees, and retail prices.

I used to be with ‘it,’ but then they changed what ‘it’ was. Now what I’m with isn’t ‘it,’ and what’s ‘it’ seems weird and scary.


#11 MARC Rider

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Posted 21 June 2017 - 10:45 AM

Looks like it's time for the return of the Zeppelins!  Or build a satellite airport in Flagstaff, where it's higher in altitude and cooler and build a rail line from Phoenix.



#12 saxman

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Posted 22 June 2017 - 07:03 PM

CRJ's are limited to ISA+35ºC for takeoff. It's pretty much Bombardier's upper limitation. ISA or International Standard Atmosphere is 15ºC (59ºF) at sea level. Phoenix is at 1135 feet elevation so it's ISA would be about 13ºC, assuming a 2ºC lapse rate per 1,000 feet of elevation. So the limitation at PHX is indeed 48ºC or 118ºF. 

 

Salt Lake City was pretty close to being over the limit too and SLC is much higher than PHX is at 4200 feet. ISA temp at SLC is about 7ºC so that would make 42ºC or 108ºF the limiting temp. Denver's maximum temperature would be even lower!


Edited by saxman, 22 June 2017 - 07:03 PM.

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#13 jis

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Posted 01 July 2017 - 01:40 PM

When the ATC is privatized they can charge Airlines extra for Take Off/Landing Clearance!

They already do. It is all packaged in the landing fee.

#14 CHamilton

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 12:12 PM

Climate change is going to make air travel even more nightmarish, study says
Flights during high heat will need to be much lighter in order to achieve liftoff

https://www.theverge...reme-heat-study


Amtrak can be better! Tell your local, state and national elected officials to support a more robust rail system. Join NARP and your local rail advocacy organization.
Where you'll find my posts: // All Aboard Washington (websiteFacebook) // Amtrak Unlimited Forum Group (Facebook) // Grow Trains (websiteFacebook, Twitter) // Restore the Pioneer Train (website, Facebook, Twitter) // Save the Seattle Waterfront Streetcar (Again) (websiteFacebook, Twitter) // Transit Riders of Puget Sound (Facebook) // Trains on FB (Facebook) // My Random Twitter Musings @HamiltonChas




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