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End of W Palm Beach Safety Patrol Trains?


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#61 jis

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Posted 09 October 2017 - 10:01 AM

If what you say is true then Amtrak should have been doing phenomenally well already. The fact that it is not strongly suggest that you have rose colored glasses on. :) Not that I am against being an optimist, mind you. ;)

 

in my view not much has really changed from the norm. There are relatively minor variations around the norm.



#62 neroden

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Posted 09 October 2017 - 10:10 AM

Thing is, the lack of clout by the Class Is mainly rebounds to the benefit of the highway interests.

Amtrak has even less clout, except (as I say) in certain states -- even there it's really the state government which has the clout, it just *uses* it on behalf of Amtrak passengers.

I believe the smarter CEOs recognize that visibly supporting Amtrak (even if they're unhelpful when it's outside the public eye) gets them sympathy and therefore *more* clout as versus the highway interests. But the dumber ones still act like it's the 1950s or 1920s, as if they have independent clout.

It really doesn't help that they've been in an adversarial relationship with freight shippers. Normally a freight shipper will step up and campaign for public support for "their" railway line... and they still do so for shortlines... but since most of the Class Is have spent most of the last several decades mercilessly removing lines and cutting service, the shippers get pretty hostile. UP and BNSF have largely stopped the cutbacks but CSX is doing it again.

I don't think you could call my point of view "optimistic" here.

Edited by neroden, 09 October 2017 - 10:16 AM.

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#63 west point

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Posted 09 October 2017 - 12:21 PM

Amtrak does not have the clout mainly because of a chicken and egg situation  Not enough service to get a loyal following except in the NEC especially when Amtrak does not have enough equipment for holidays.  Not enough loyal following to demand more equipment on present trains and more trains and destinations..  Big example is not enough trains on a route to justify more food catering locations.  That way food service could be vastly improved and more persons served with more restocking locations.



#64 neroden

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 12:04 PM

Amtrak does not have the clout mainly because of a chicken and egg situation  Not enough service to get a loyal following except in the NEC especially when Amtrak does not have enough equipment for holidays.  Not enough loyal following to demand more equipment on present trains and more trains and destinations...

Exactly!  Thanks for putting it clearly. 

 

Now, consider a state with relatively little Class I freight presence, but enough Amtrak to have a loyal ridership of meaningful size:

 

-- Vermont

-- Maine

-- Massachusetts

 

In these states Amtrak has more clout than a Class I.  (Honestly I wouldn't be surprised if Michigan were in this category too.)

 

 

Consider a state where half the population is openly fighting the Class I over coal service and the other half is angry about poor agricultural service, again with enough Amtrak to have a loyal ridership of meaningful size:

 

-- Washington

 

Or a state where half the population is complaining about railyard pollution, again with enough Amtrak to have a loyal ridership of meaningful size:

 

-- California

 

Here... it's not obvious to me who has more clout.

 

Then, consider a state where there is no significant loyal Amtrak patronage and lots of Class I service without too many local complaints:

 

-- Georgia

-- South Carolina

 

Yeah, here Amtrak has no clout whatsoever and the Class Is have a lot.


Edited by neroden, 12 October 2017 - 12:04 PM.

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