New Support for Gulf States service resumption

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A lotta of yada, yada, yada - but the article is still mostly about a pipe dream.
Yes that's possible but if the incoming administration, congress and state politicians along the route are all behind restoring service as the article reports, then I believe that it can and will happen but it won't be short term. There is little equipment available to start new routes. Amtrak must buy new Superliners, restore the necessary signaling on the route, the stations restored by the states, and its a go in 3-5 years
 
The big issue, as I see it, is the lack of any synchronization of schedules in New Orleans. If they extend CoNO, as is being discussed, that will be a good way to get from Chicago to Biloxi but will be useless going from Houston or El Paso to Biloxi. As long as none of the trains connect at New Orleans the whole region will be tail-end-charlie for rail transportation.
 
No hotels in New Orleans.

No night life to speak of.

No reason at all to stop in New Orleans.

Inter connective would be a nice goal. Service East would be good too.
Well and good, provided that your objective is to visit New Orleans. If your objective is to get to Houston or Biloxi or Hattiesburg, not so much. Imagine if you wanted to get from Baltimore to Richmond but you'd have to stay overnight in DC. Would you take the train or find some other way?
 
No hotels in New Orleans.

No night life to speak of.

No reason at all to stop in New Orleans.

Inter connective would be a nice goal. Service East would be good too.
Well and good, provided that your objective is to visit New Orleans. If your objective is to get to Houston or Biloxi or Hattiesburg, not so much. Imagine if you wanted to get from Baltimore to Richmond but you'd have to stay overnight in DC. Would you take the train or find some other way?
If you are driving from upstate NY to Chicago, you have to stay overnight somewhere, unless you're crazy. If you're driving from upstate New York to Minneapolis, you have to stay overnight *twice*.

It all depends on whether the number of overnight stays is less-than-or-equal-to the number you'd need when driving.
 
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No hotels in New Orleans.

No night life to speak of.

No reason at all to stop in New Orleans.

Inter connective would be a nice goal. Service East would be good too.
Well and good, provided that your objective is to visit New Orleans. If your objective is to get to Houston or Biloxi or Hattiesburg, not so much. Imagine if you wanted to get from Baltimore to Richmond but you'd have to stay overnight in DC. Would you take the train or find some other way?
If you are driving from upstate NY to Chicago, you have to stay overnight somewhere, unless you're crazy. If you're driving from upstate New York to Minneapolis, you have to stay overnight *twice*.

It all depends on whether the number of overnight stays is less-than-or-equal-to the number you'd need when driving.
I did Google Maps between Ithaca and New York and got 16 hr, 40 min. I believe you would only need one overnight if driving.

The other problem with staying overnight in NOL is it's on your dime as opposed to the night you're sleeping on the train.
 
Service East of NOL is needed.

Service East of NOL that does not require a hotel stay in NOL to interconnect with other trains going north, west, and northeast would be nice. Just not as important as a train itself.

Feel free to adjust the NOL Trains into a Chicago style of schedule. It would be interest to see all the effects that it would happen across the timetable. Heck maybe San Antonio might get better calling times.

Of course some of the states are going to want daylight service....
 
I did Google Maps between Ithaca and New York and got 16 hr, 40 min.
Didn't you mean between Ithica and Minneapolis? And if you agree with the Wikipedia definition of "upstate NY", you could have countered with Ripley NY to Minneapolis being only 13 ± ½ hours - an easy 1 day trip for a young person with a lead foot..
 
No hotels in New Orleans.

No night life to speak of.

No reason at all to stop in New Orleans.

Inter connective would be a nice goal. Service East would be good too.
Well and good, provided that your objective is to visit New Orleans. If your objective is to get to Houston or Biloxi or Hattiesburg, not so much. Imagine if you wanted to get from Baltimore to Richmond but you'd have to stay overnight in DC. Would you take the train or find some other way?
If you are driving from upstate NY to Chicago, you have to stay overnight somewhere, unless you're crazy. If you're driving from upstate New York to Minneapolis, you have to stay overnight *twice*.

It all depends on whether the number of overnight stays is less-than-or-equal-to the number you'd need when driving.
I did Google Maps between Ithaca and New York and got 16 hr, 40 min. I believe you would only need one overnight if driving.

The other problem with staying overnight in NOL is it's on your dime as opposed to the night you're sleeping on the train.
Speaking for myself, I could do 16:40 in about 15h (maybe less- I rarely go under 75 or 10 over, whichevers faster) of on the road time with 4 1-hour meal/coffee/bathroom/Red Bull breaks. I tend to think that most people who actually like driving and live in the middle of nowhere (and are this used to driving marathons) could do the same.

When I say I think I could do it, I mean do it without triggering my cars "Attention Alert" drowsiness detection system.
 
Speaking for myself, I could do 16:40 in about 15h (maybe less- I rarely go under 75 or 10 over, whichevers faster) of on the road time with 4 1-hour meal/coffee/bathroom/Red Bull breaks. I tend to think that most people who actually like driving and live in the middle of nowhere (and are this used to driving marathons) could do the same.

When I say I think I could do it, I mean do it without triggering my cars "Attention Alert" drowsiness detection system.
One of the reasons we opted to take the train from Hattiesburg to Washington is because my wife simply can't do those marathon drives, even as a passenger. We're limited to about 500 miles (say, 8 hours) per day with frequent get-out-and-walk-around breaks. The advantage of the train is that she could get up and walk around while the train was still moving. The rest of my family regularly make marathon drives with only minimal breaks to refuel, eat and pee. (e.g. S. Ala to SE Okla in one shot. Neb-Fla in two days) I figured that for us to drive from S. MS to DC would take us three days. That's ~$500 (round trip) for food and lodging on top of the fuel and wear on the car. If you figure the car at 40¢/mile, that's ~$1600 round trip. Of course, most people value their car mileage at a much lower amount, unless someone else is paying.
 
No hotels in New Orleans.

No night life to speak of.

No reason at all to stop in New Orleans.

Inter connective would be a nice goal. Service East would be good too.
Well and good, provided that your objective is to visit New Orleans. If your objective is to get to Houston or Biloxi or Hattiesburg, not so much. Imagine if you wanted to get from Baltimore to Richmond but you'd have to stay overnight in DC. Would you take the train or find some other way?
If you are driving from upstate NY to Chicago, you have to stay overnight somewhere, unless you're crazy. If you're driving from upstate New York to Minneapolis, you have to stay overnight *twice*.

It all depends on whether the number of overnight stays is less-than-or-equal-to the number you'd need when driving.
Some of the above is false. It depends on your stamina, I suppose. I once drove from Boston to Blue Island, IL in one day, and have done New York City-Chicago more than once, in a single day. Wouldn't do it any more though!!
 
Resumption of this route is important.. If and when the Gulf states line is resumed it will offer Florida residents a more direct cross country route to Los Angeles. Traveling North to WAS then-CHI-LAX is a very long indirect and inconvenient route.
 
Except that the CONO/SL will not not connect without an overnight stay in New Orleans, so it really doesn't matter at all. Besides, if you're willing to spend three and a half days on travel, how big a deal can it possibly be to spend four and a half? I feel like after a certain point long before that you've given up on placing any value on time.
 
Resumption of this route is important.. If and when the Gulf states line is resumed it will offer Florida residents a more direct cross country route to Los Angeles. Traveling North to WAS then-CHI-LAX is a very long indirect and inconvenient route.
Other than hard-core rail fans, I don't know anyone who would ride a train for something like 72 hours to get from Jacksonville to Los Angeles. That's the equivalent to riding a train from Madrid to Moscow.
 
Resumption of this route is important.. If and when the Gulf states line is resumed it will offer Florida residents a more direct cross country route to Los Angeles. Traveling North to WAS then-CHI-LAX is a very long indirect and inconvenient route.
Other than hard-core rail fans, I don't know anyone who would ride a train for something like 72 hours to get from Jacksonville to Los Angeles. That's the equivalent to riding a train from Madrid to Moscow.
The transcontinental SL did last about 12 years (1993-2005) and probably would still exist today if it weren't for Katrina. I know I've done East Coast to LAX or vice versa with just the same day transfer in CHI. If there was a northern transcontinental say LAX-NYP or LAX-WAS (we all know LAX-PHL will never happen) I'd do it.

Even if nobody wants to do LAX-Florida, how about SAS-Florida or HOS-Florida? You'd cut a lot of time there with the ability to do a same day transfer. 4.5 days vs. 3.5 days may not be a big deal but 2.5 days vs. 1.5 day is a much bigger difference. If I had my way the SL would leave at night after any new Gulf Coast train or the Crescent. Right now the westbound train arrives in SAS and LAX during the graveyard shift anyway.
 
Resumption of this route is important.. If and when the Gulf states line is resumed it will offer Florida residents a more direct cross country route to Los Angeles. Traveling North to WAS then-CHI-LAX is a very long indirect and inconvenient route.
Other than hard-core rail fans, I don't know anyone who would ride a train for something like 72 hours to get from Jacksonville to Los Angeles. That's the equivalent to riding a train from Madrid to Moscow.
There are people who can't fly (for medical reasons), won't fly (for any number of reasons) and people who like to see the country on their travels.
 
I've actually *done* Ithaca to Minneapolis. Five times each way. Doing it with one overnight not only requires a marathon drive, it also requires substantial night driving, and it requires being *lucky*.

If you hit a slowdown due to Chicago or Cleveland traffic, you cannot do it. If there's a bridge out on the Ohio Turnpike (happened), you cannot do it. If there's road construction for 300 miles on the Ohio Turnpike (happened), you can't do it.

You have to expect that it will take two overnights.
 
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Resumption of this route is important.. If and when the Gulf states line is resumed it will offer Florida residents a more direct cross country route to Los Angeles. Traveling North to WAS then-CHI-LAX is a very long indirect and inconvenient route.
Other than hard-core rail fans, I don't know anyone who would ride a train for something like 72 hours to get from Jacksonville to Los Angeles. That's the equivalent to riding a train from Madrid to Moscow.
As already and correctly pointed out, it really wouldn't matter even if absolutely no one rides a long-distance train endpoint-to-endpoint. The real business is to and from intermediate points. Potentially, a train could be sold out along several segments of the route, nearly empty near the final destination, and again with nobody traveling the entire distance. However, at least a handful of people do travel the whole route, sometimes connecting to yet another train to complete their journey. They aren't all hardcore railfans. People travel everyday across the nation by bus or private automobile, and nobody questions it. Why then, do some people find it so incomprehensible that passengers would take a train to make the same journey?

One of the biggest misconceptions of, for example, the current Sunset Limited is that it is a New Orleans to Los Angeles service. Oh, the train does cover that entire route and Amtrak will be glad to sell you a ticket, but most passengers are only travelling shorter distances along the line. Critics of passenger rail harp over and over and over again about how trains only make sense for trips of maybe 350-500 miles (or so), blissfully unaware that is exactly how Amtrak's long-distance routes are typically being used. .

Finally, it should also be pointed out there are no plans to resume the Sunset Limited to Florida. The restored service will not involve anyone travelling coast to coast anyway. It is the City of New Orleans which is proposed to be extended to Orlando.
 
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The transcontinental SL did last about 12 years (1993-2005) and probably would still exist today if it weren't for Katrina. I know I've done East Coast to LAX or vice versa with just the same day transfer in CHI. If there was a northern transcontinental say LAX-NYP or LAX-WAS (we all know LAX-PHL will never happen) I'd do it.

Even if nobody wants to do LAX-Florida, how about SAS-Florida or HOS-Florida? You'd cut a lot of time there with the ability to do a same day transfer. 4.5 days vs. 3.5 days may not be a big deal but 2.5 days vs. 1.5 day is a much bigger difference. If I had my way the SL would leave at night after any new Gulf Coast train or the Crescent. Right now the westbound train arrives in SAS and LAX during the graveyard shift anyway.
Yes. The Sunset Limited ran right through my town until Katrina. Very few riders and even fewer rode from Fla to Cal. I once looked at riding Gulfport-DeFuniak Springs but when I realized that it took something like 8 hours and someone would have to pick me up at oh-dark-thirty, I opted to drive the 3.5 hours.

There are people who can't fly (for medical reasons), won't fly (for any number of reasons) and people who like to see the country on their travels.
I believe that Pierre Salinger refused to fly and would only take ships between the US and Europe. He was in a very small minority. My brother-in-law is one who will no longer fly. He's made mostly of metal replacement parts, usually in pain and somewhat claustrophobic to-boot. What he goes through in security screening was enough by itself for him to swear off flying. The people who "like to see the country" are either "drivers" or "rail fans".

Amtrak was quick to "forget about" the NOL-JAX half of the Sunset when Katrina so conveniently disrupted its schedule. It was that big of a money sink. It just occurred to me that, for the entire time that Amtrak's Sunset ran the NOL-JAX segment, I have lived within a few miles of a station on this route and never once found the occasion to ride it. It was just that useless. The only people I know who did ride it were the same ones who'd travel 1000 miles to ride some special steam train.

The proposal to have the CoNO make a hard left at New Orleans and continue east seems moderately useful. Maybe I'll ride it to Jackson some day. I'd still have to drive 75 miles to take the Crescent to Atlanta, or DC. As long as nothing connects in New Orleans, rail travel in the Gulf South will be mostly inconvenient, at best.
 
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