Southwest Chief & Grand Canyon questions :)

Hi everyone,

I like to research things and hope I understand the SWC & Grand Canyon options correctly. My questions are:

1. After riding the train to Flagstaff or Williams Junction, is taking "The Train" overkill? Does the convenience of it outweigh the cost? Or is there a good hotel within short walking distance of the Flagstaff station, then taking the Arizona Shuttle just as convenient? (I'm assuming it would be less expensive.)

2. I've tried to research this next question and no matter what search terms I use, I can't find a good answer, so hopefully you'll be able to help me: Which is the preferred route (best scenery, timing for Grand Canyon connection) on the SWC - LAX to CHI or CHI to LAX?

3. Is April a good time to go on the SW Chief? (I think if I go late April, the Canyon weather may be less iffy, according to my research.)

Thank you for your help and advice. I'm having such a good time with my trip planning!

Several discussions are to be found by searching "Grand Canyon" ...

http://discuss.amtraktrains.com/index.php?/topic/62887-grand-canyon-by-amtrak/

Good evening from Flagstaff - There could be various opinions on the merits of the Grand Canyon train. I have not ridden it from Williams in ten years and might take it sometime soon too see what my opinion will be. It depends on how enthused you are about train travel. However, it is not terribly inaccurate to say that the Grand Canyon Railway can be rather expensive and also that it is not a particularly scenic trip. When I worked at Grand Canyon several years ago it made me crazy to see ads for the train picturing a steam locomotive within Grand Canyon. Rubbish. There is only a tiny glimpse of the Canyon from the train as it passes the grade crossing entering the village. Some of the curves in the forested canyon a few miles south of the village are kind of interesting, but otherwise the scenery is nothing to rave about. If you enjoy cops and robbers scenes on the way back, then it may be for you. I would rather see through cars like the Santa Fe used to run up to Grand Canyon come back, but that would be in the snowballs in hell category.

I am not sure if I understand your routing question: If approaching Williams coming from the west or going to Los Angeles, the connection to the Grand Canyon train can be made the same day, without an overnight stay being necessary, if you don't mind waiting around several hours. From the east, it is necessary to stay overnight. There are numerous hotel possibilities in Flagstaff. Please private message me if you have more questions. Sure, April would be a good time to visit, but having lived there for four years at Grand Canyon, October was my favorite month.

Maybe I've misunderstood, but I thought the train reaches all of the possible Grand Canyon connection stops too late for transfers that night. (At least from CHI to LAX.)

Okay, I think I understand - traveling from LAX to CHI would work for connecting to a train or shuttle transfer to the Grand Canyon because it arrives early in the morning. Right?

Which do you think is the more scenic route (LAX to CHI or CHI to LAX)?

Thanks for your help!

Only differences between the Westbound #3 and the Eastbound #4 if the Trains are on Time:

#4: Leave LAX as it gets dark, Sun comes up around Winslow, AZ, starts getting dark after going through Raton Pass into Colorado, Sun comes up as you get to Kansas City.

#3: Leave CHI in afternoon, gets Dark around crossing the Mississippi River from Iowa into Missouri, Sun will come up in Colorado around Lamar, it will get dark between Albuquerque and Gallup, NM and the Sun will come up in California before you get to the LA burbs.

Basically the same scenery in Daylight, except going into LA on #3 Westbound and across part of Arizona, Western New Mexico and from Kansas City through Missouri, bit of Iowa and on to CHI on #4 Eastbound.

I'd say it's worth it to take the Grand Canyon Railway (GCR) one way, and Arizona Shuttle the other. Note that it's usually cheaper to buy one-way GCR tickets on amtrak.com: if you call 1-800-THE-TRAIN, they charge you the round-trip fare for one-way travel. The station to enter on amtrak.com is "Grand Canyon Natl Park, AZ (GCN)" and GCR is listed as "7903/7904 Thruway Train". When booked this way, GCR is only about $25 more than the Arizona Shuttle (one-way). The most convenient connection to Amtrak is as follows:

GCN-WMA
7903 Thruway Train
3:30pm - 5:45pm

WMA-WMC
6903 Bus
9:10pm - 9:20pm

WMJ-LAX
3 Southwest Chief
9:33pm - 8:15am

This way, you can have a leisurely dinner in Williams and continue on to LA at a civilized time.

darien-l said:

I'd say it's worth it to take the Grand Canyon Railway (GCR) one way, and Arizona Shuttle the other. Note that it's usually cheaper to buy one-way GCR tickets on amtrak.com: if you call 1-800-THE-TRAIN, they charge you the round-trip fare for one-way travel. The station to enter on amtrak.com is "Grand Canyon Natl Park, AZ (GCN)" and GCR is listed as "7903/7904 Thruway Train". When booked this way, GCR is only about $25 more than the Arizona Shuttle (one-way). The most convenient connection to Amtrak is as follows:

GCN-WMA
7903 Thruway Train
3:30pm - 5:45pm

WMA-WMC
6903 Bus
9:10pm - 9:20pm

WMJ-LAX
3 Southwest Chief
9:33pm - 8:15am

This way, you can have a leisurely dinner in Williams and continue on to LA at a civilized time.

Click to expand...

The Grand Canyon Railway shuttle is always there...they know in advance (from Amtrak) when passengers are expected to board or de-train from the SWC and what time.

Yes. But.

Never mind. Brain fart.

Thank you, everyone! Darien, I didn't know I could book all the way through to the Grand Canyon (I thought I'd have to reserve the train by calling them).

From playing around with Amtrak reservations, it seems that going from CHI to LAX may work better time-wise because I could spend the night in the Railway hotel (whatever it's called) and then go to the Grand Canyon the next morning. Can I reserve the Arizona Shuttle from the hotel?

Then the next day's journey to LAX would work well, just like you outlined above.

So glad I asked about this before I made more definite plans!

KmH said:

Yes. But.

Never mind. Brain fart.

Click to expand...

I get those often.

I have a question, I'll be a first timer and will be arriving in Charlottesville VA AT 2:49pm then needing to take thruway that departs at 3:10. Then again arriving in Newport News at 9:10 and a thruway at 9:25. Is this common and a reasonable time in between? Do Amtrak staff help point you in the right direction of the connections?

The SWC doesn't go to VA and the Grand Canyon is in AZ.

But the timing on both your connections is pretty tight.

I don't know how often the trains into there run late.

The Charlottesville Amtrak station looks to be about as big as a McDonald's, and it looks like the thruway bus connection is right there at the station. (Google Maps - Satellite View)

Amtrak's web site shows the station has a ticket office that is open from 6 am to 9:30 pm, so yes it's likely someone would be a round to offer assistance.

MyJourneys said:

Thank you, everyone! Darien, I didn't know I could book all the way through to the Grand Canyon (I thought I'd have to reserve the train by calling them).

From playing around with Amtrak reservations, it seems that going from CHI to LAX may work better time-wise because I could spend the night in the Railway hotel (whatever it's called) and then go to the Grand Canyon the next morning. Can I reserve the Arizona Shuttle from the hotel?

Then the next day's journey to LAX would work well, just like you outlined above.

So glad I asked about this before I made more definite plans!

Click to expand...

You can do that -- the Arizona Shuttle stops right at the Grand Canyon Railway Hotel. But if you're going to stay there, you might as well take the Grand Canyon Railway round-trip -- it's only about $70 in coach, and I think you get a discount if you book it as a package deal with a hotel stay. Instead, you may want to consider staying in Flagstaff -- the AZ Shuttle departs from the Amtrak station downtown, there are several hotels within a couple of blocks of Amtrak, and Flagstaff is much more interesting than Williams. There are a number of things to do in town that don't require a car. If you take the 12:45p AZ Shuttle out to Grand Canyon, you could, for example, tour Riordan Mansion or go for a walk at Thorpe Park in the morning. Then, on the way back, you would just connect to Amtrak on GCR via Williams.

Darien, if I book all the way through (CHI to Grand Canyon with the Grand Canyon Railway included), how does the "The Train" know that I'm already booked? I've read that if you're booked on the train, they'll hold your luggage for you until the train departs, but if I don't have a ticket, how do I prove that?

Thanks again!

I'm taking a nice trip from Austin to Santa Fe, Winslow, then the Grand Canyon and finally Los Angeles coming up in February.

The schedule I worked out is to arrive at Williams and spend the night at the Grand Canyon Hotel, then take the train out to the canyon the next morning. I splurged and got the dome car even though I realize the view isn't that spectacular. After spending a couple of nights at El Tovar, I'll be taking the Amtrak shuttle back to Flagstaff to connect to the SWC to get to LA. I decided to go to Flagstaff just to get on the train and into the roomette a little earlier for a better nights sleep. The Xanterra reservation lady was very helpful in making sure that all our luggage would be able to get to the canyon since the train policy is usually only 1 item per passenger. But she found out you can pay a little more to get it all there and delivered to the hotel upon arrival.

Only concern I have is getting the luggage from El Tovar to the Grand Canyon bus stop. I guess if it is necessary we could take a short taxi ride there.

I used to work at Grand Canyon. This might have changed, but the Arizona Shuttle ( not Amtrak Shuttle ) leaves from Maswik Lodge about a mile from El Tovar on the west side of the village away from the rim. Since you have baggage, I would suggest using the local taxi service rather than the local Shuttle bus, although the latter is free.

If you have more questions about GC, please ask.

Greatcats, I'm not sure if you were answering my question or not, but I have "the train" both into and out of the Canyon, not the shuttle.

I was replying to Gues Texas Rider.