Jump to content




Help Support AmtrakTrains.com by donating using the link above or becoming a Supporting Member.

Photo

Amtrak Gateway and NJ HSR


  • Please log in to reply
36 replies to this topic

#21 Thirdrail7

Thirdrail7

    Engineer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,173 posts

Posted 19 January 2018 - 11:51 PM

I saw them installing them at Hamilton when I went into the city for a family event. I was amazed what percentage of the slow moving installers where just people who stood around sounding horns.

 

The FRA is quite serious about watchmen. This tidbit from CFR 214.329 may help:

 

 

Train approach warning shall be given in sufficient time to enable each roadway worker to move to and occupy a previously arranged place of safety not less than 15 seconds before a train moving at the maximum authorized speed on that track can pass the location of the roadway worker. The place of safety to be occupied upon the approach of a train may not be on a track, unless working limits are established on that track.

 

Track speed is 135mph in that are so that means is moving approximately 200 feet per second so they have to spread out and elongate the warning since the train would cover more than a half of a mile in 15 seconds.


They say laughter is the best medicine. Obviously they never posted on AU.


#22 DSS&A

DSS&A

    Lead Service Attendant

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 247 posts

Posted 13 February 2018 - 06:44 PM

Hi,
New information is out about the tunnel construction and adjusted spoils removsl plans. The two links to the meeting PowerPoint presenations are at the link below.

http://www.railroad....6488&start=1425

#23 Thirdrail7

Thirdrail7

    Engineer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,173 posts

Posted 18 February 2018 - 08:21 PM

Finally, some good news....if you don't drive a vehicle over one of the Port Authority's bridges or tunnels.

 

Port Authority votes to spend an additional $44M for Hudson River tunnel project

 


 

Despite no commitment from the Trump administration, the Port Authority on Thursday voted to spend another $44 million on a multibillion-dollar Hudson River tunnel project.

Port officials who are backing the tunnel construction as part of Amtrak’s massive Gateway project said the money is necessary to keep the project moving, so that when federal funding materializes, there will be no delay in construction.

“It’s momentum,” Port Authority director Rick Cotton said of the money requested from the Gateway Development Corp., which is overseeing the project.

Construction can start on one part of the project, the Portal Bridge, in New Jersey this year, officials said. The Hudson River tunnel is under design, with officials hoping to start construction next year.


They say laughter is the best medicine. Obviously they never posted on AU.


#24 bmorechris

bmorechris

    Service Attendant

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 66 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Baltimore, MD
  • Interests:Trains, local transportation history, mechanical/marine engineering, travel

Posted 02 March 2018 - 09:23 PM

This sounds non-optimal

Brief fair use quote:
President Trump is pushing congressional Republicans not to fund a crucial infrastructure project a long-delayed plan to build a new rail tunnel between Manhattan and New Jersey setting up a confrontation that could complicate passage of a massive government spending bill this month.

Trump personally appealed to House Speaker Paul D. Ryan (R-Wis.) this week to target federal funding for the $30 billion Gateway project, which would construct a tunnel into New Yorks Penn Station to supplement two aging tubes that are at risk of failing in the coming years.

https://www.washingt...:homepage/story

Edited by bmorechris, 02 March 2018 - 09:24 PM.


#25 west point

west point

    Engineer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,576 posts

Posted 02 March 2018 - 10:30 PM

It is strange that even the Washington Post article does not note that Gateway is a multi part construction item.  They made it sound like the tunnel will cost $30.0 B .  But Gateway is the tunnel , North and probably south Portal bridges, 4 tracking from Newark Penn to the new tunnel and old tunnel, Secaucus loop, NYP upgrades.  Hey Wa Po get your writer corrected ! .


  • CCC1007 and cpotisch like this

#26 B757Guy

B757Guy

    Service Attendant

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 82 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 03 March 2018 - 02:51 PM

By the time this is completed and operational, I'm pretty sure my current teenage boys will be married, with adult children.  :(


I'm an airline pilot with a major US based carrier, and avid lover of trains since the very early days of Amtrak. I fondly recall GG1's zipping along the NEC, and sleeping in a slumbercoach on the Montrealer as a kid. I miss the old heritage cars, the GG1 and the original Budd Metroliners. The new equipment today simply doesn't have the same personality and elegance...


#27 Thirdrail7

Thirdrail7

    Engineer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,173 posts

Posted 14 June 2018 - 04:02 PM

NJT is putting their money up, hoping the Feds do the same.

 

New Jersey to Borrow More to Help Pay for Portal Bridge Replacement

 

Here is a not so brief fair use quote. Hopefully, the mods will trim as necessary:

 


 

Earlier this year, Transportation Secretary Elaine Chao challenged New York and New Jersey to put more “skin in the game” to pay for the Gateway program, which includes the replacement of the Portal Bridge at Kearny, N.J.

A senior official in the administration of New Jersey Gov. Phil Murphy said Wednesday: “They asked us for skin in the game. We are showing them we’ve got skin in the game.”

Until this week, New York and New Jersey had jointly committed more than $600 million toward the $1.7 billion bridge project. But federal transportation officials viewed the commitment with skepticism.

The Trump administration saw the plan for the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey to take out a federal loan of almost $300 million as not counting toward local funding for the project.

Although New Jersey had also committed to a bond issuance of more than $300 million for the bridge, no formal authorization for such an issuance had been given.

That changed this week when New Jersey Economic Development Authority approved the sale of $600 million in bonds to pay for the bridge. NJ Transit will repay the money in the form of rental payments funded by New Jersey’s Transportation Trust Fund.

The Port Authority is expected to shift its commitment to cover almost $300 million in federal loans to other projects that are part of Gateway, pending approval of the agency’s board.

The new Portal Bridge project is fully designed and has all of the necessary regulatory approvals. But it is in limbo after the Trump administration held up federal funding while suggesting that New York and New Jersey should contribute more to the project.


They say laughter is the best medicine. Obviously they never posted on AU.


#28 railiner

railiner

    Engineer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,533 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Queens, NY
  • Interests:All public transportation....land, sea, and air

Posted 14 June 2018 - 09:19 PM

 

NJT is putting their money up, hoping the Feds do the same.

 

New Jersey to Borrow More to Help Pay for Portal Bridge Replacement

 

Here is a not so brief fair use quote. Hopefully, the mods will trim as necessary:

 


 

Earlier this year, Transportation Secretary Elaine Chao challenged New York and New Jersey to put more “skin in the game” to pay for the Gateway program, which includes the replacement of the Portal Bridge at Kearny, N.J.

A senior official in the administration of New Jersey Gov. Phil Murphy said Wednesday: “They asked us for skin in the game. We are showing them we’ve got skin in the game.”

Until this week, New York and New Jersey had jointly committed more than $600 million toward the $1.7 billion bridge project. But federal transportation officials viewed the commitment with skepticism.

The Trump administration saw the plan for the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey to take out a federal loan of almost $300 million as not counting toward local funding for the project.

Although New Jersey had also committed to a bond issuance of more than $300 million for the bridge, no formal authorization for such an issuance had been given.

That changed this week when New Jersey Economic Development Authority approved the sale of $600 million in bonds to pay for the bridge. NJ Transit will repay the money in the form of rental payments funded by New Jersey’s Transportation Trust Fund.

The Port Authority is expected to shift its commitment to cover almost $300 million in federal loans to other projects that are part of Gateway, pending approval of the agency’s board.

The new Portal Bridge project is fully designed and has all of the necessary regulatory approvals. But it is in limbo after the Trump administration held up federal funding while suggesting that New York and New Jersey should contribute more to the project.

 

Good thing Christie is gone... ;)


metroblue?

okay on the blue!

#29 DSS&A

DSS&A

    Lead Service Attendant

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 247 posts

Posted 02 August 2018 - 05:52 AM

New computer simulation movie clips for trains running on the new Portal Bridge and the Gateway tunnels have been posted to illustrate what the completed projects would look like. The Portal bridge simulation has a 3-D movie format. The Gateway tunnel simulation is a little different in that it has both a look-down views at the top of the screen and a cross-section view at the bottom of the screen showing how deep the tunnels will be at different locations.

https://www.rtands.c...n-river-tunnels

Edited by DSS&A, 03 August 2018 - 06:20 AM.


#30 Acela150

Acela150

    Engineer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,565 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:NS Harrisburg Division

Posted 02 August 2018 - 08:12 PM

Videos 

 

 


  • railiner, sitzplatz17 and cpotisch like this
These posts are my views and opinions.

Donate your spare time! Be a Volunteer Firefighter!
 
"Mainline 66W Recrew On Board at Abrams ready to head east when you can handle us, Ok 66W, ok on signal indication at Norris, take it to the Falls to wait for the window"

#31 railiner

railiner

    Engineer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,533 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Queens, NY
  • Interests:All public transportation....land, sea, and air

Posted 02 August 2018 - 10:09 PM

Great video's...the local television station's only played a very short clip from them...thanks so much for posting them! :)


metroblue?

okay on the blue!

#32 Andrew

Andrew

    OBS Chief

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 381 posts

Posted 16 August 2018 - 07:22 PM

Below are the video presentation and presentation from the Hudson Tunnel Project Industry day:

 

https://players.brig...d=5814679276001

 

http://www.gatewaypr...tions-FINAL.pdf



#33 railiner

railiner

    Engineer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,533 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Queens, NY
  • Interests:All public transportation....land, sea, and air

Posted 17 August 2018 - 12:56 AM

I didn't watch the video, but did scroll thru the other...

Just curious why the new tunnel doesn't just go straight across, parallel to the old tunnel?


metroblue?

okay on the blue!

#34 jis

jis

    Engineer

  • Gathering Team Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 22,515 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Space Coast, Florida, Area code 3-2-1
  • Interests:Trains, Planes and Travel

Posted 17 August 2018 - 10:47 AM

 

Just curious why the new tunnel doesn't just go straight across, parallel to the old tunnel?

Because they are larger diameter bore than the old tunnels and they are being bored deeper to provide for a guaranteed protective thick layer of earth below the river bed between the river bed and the top of the bore. Because it has to go deeper using a grade limited to 2.3%, they have to be longer than the old tunnels. The only way to get greater length between two fixed points is to curve the route. Of course the other concern about getting too close to the old tunnels was that that may not be good for the health of the old tunnels.

 

In spite of using a deeper path, there is about 300'-400' at the New York end where the top of the tunnel will be too close to the river bed. This will require pre-grouting the river bed to solidify it enough to be able to withstand the TBM drilling through it without blowing out to the river bed. PRR can probably repeat what he posted on this matter on railroad.net, where we discussed this matter sometime back.

 

Incidentally, for those that did not notice, this pair of tunnels will have cross passages connecting the two at regular intervals to facilitate escape from fire or other hazard in one tunnel to the other. This is why those that keep harping on building just one tunnel are whistling in the wind. Such a tunnel would be considerably less safe, unless a parallel escape tunnel is constructed. And if you have to do that then might as well make it a full size second tunnel.


  • railiner, daybeers and cpotisch like this

#35 railiner

railiner

    Engineer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,533 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Queens, NY
  • Interests:All public transportation....land, sea, and air

Posted 17 August 2018 - 03:43 PM

Thanks, JIS, that makes it pretty clear now... :)


  • jis likes this
metroblue?

okay on the blue!

#36 west point

west point

    Engineer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,576 posts

Posted 17 August 2018 - 06:13 PM


 

Incidentally, for those that did not notice, this pair of tunnels will have cross passages connecting the two at regular intervals to facilitate escape from fire or other hazard in one tunnel to the other. This is why those that keep harping on building just one tunnel are whistling in the wind. Such a tunnel would be considerably less safe, unless a parallel escape tunnel is constructed. And if you have to do that then might as well make it a full size second tunnel.

 

JIS thanks for that point/  We have debated this before.  Even the light rail bores now being done especially SEA use this same method.  On the other end the Chunnel and Gottard  Base tunnel.


  • jis likes this

#37 PRR 60

PRR 60

    Engineer

  • Admin
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,148 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 17 August 2018 - 07:12 PM

 

Just curious why the new tunnel doesn't just go straight across, parallel to the old tunnel?

Because they are larger diameter bore than the old tunnels and they are being bored deeper to provide for a guaranteed protective thick layer of earth below the river bed between the river bed and the top of the bore. Because it has to go deeper using a grade limited to 2.3%, they have to be longer than the old tunnels. The only way to get greater length between two fixed points is to curve the route. Of course the other concern about getting too close to the old tunnels was that that may not be good for the health of the old tunnels.
 
In spite of using a deeper path, there is about 300'-400' at the New York end where the top of the tunnel will be too close to the river bed. This will require pre-grouting the river bed to solidify it enough to be able to withstand the TBM drilling through it without blowing out to the river bed. PRR can probably repeat what he posted on this matter on railroad.net, where we discussed this matter sometime back.
 
Incidentally, for those that did not notice, this pair of tunnels will have cross passages connecting the two at regular intervals to facilitate escape from fire or other hazard in one tunnel to the other. This is why those that keep harping on building just one tunnel are whistling in the wind. Such a tunnel would be considerably less safe, unless a parallel escape tunnel is constructed. And if you have to do that then might as well make it a full size second tunnel.

 

 
This is what I posted. This reply was in response to a statement that the tunnel construction would not require river disturbance.
 

On the east (Manhattan) end of the proposed tunnel, the combination of inadequate cover (as low as 9.5 feet) and poor geotechnical conditions will not permit TBM boring without ground modification. This will impact tunnel construction in the river from a point 200 feet west of the Manhattan pierline and extending 550 feet west toward New Jersey. The method to stabilize the soil in this area will be grout injection - essentially pressure injecting columns of grout in a pattern that establishes a hardened layer from the riverbed to the midpoint of the proposed tunnel cross-sections. Once that hardened layer is established, the TBM will be able to safely bore the tunnels.

Due to the riverbed disturbance and material displacement, the grout injection work in the river will be performed within large sheetpile cofferdams - not unlike what would be used for cut and cover construction. Three rectangular sheetpile cofferdams will be installed sequentially from east to west: the first two being 200' linear by 120' wide and the third being 150' by 120'. Once a sheetpile cofferdam is in place, the water within the cofferdam will be pumped down in order to lower the interior water elevation to about two feet lower than the water elevation outside. This ensures water inflow and not outflow and will prevent disturbed material from exiting the cofferdam. Surrounding each cofferdam. a 100' perimeter area will be reserved for mooring of work barges. As the jet grouting proceeds, displaced material will be retained within the cofferdam, removed by excavators, and transported to an approved disposal site, Once an area is completed, turbid water will be processed, the cofferdam will be removed and the process will start over until all three sections are completed .

The three cofferdams, the grout injection wotk and associated material removal will be a substantial on-river operation. Is is kind of "cut and cover lite." As such, the work will be subject to permits and procedures from the USACE, the USCG and others for both the river work and material disposal.

 






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users